Rebel Ahsoka

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FlorisV
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Rebel Ahsoka

Post by FlorisV »

Felt a bit premature to submit this as a Competitive Balance issue and we're already awaiting some serious changes to a bunch of decks but still. While we have more overpowered cards in the game...doesn't this card look like it's going to be a problem? You can't kill her with 4-Lom or Epp Maul (ok fine). As for Cad Bane, just add a character for forfeit and DS stil needs to draw a 2 at least if Dengar shoots the other one(s)...

Oh and then there's I Can Take Care Of Myself. It's just very hard to kill her by conventional means. OK you can run Imperial Justice v and track a 5. Or try to overpower. Or run A Day Long Remembered v which prevents you from EPP shooting at extra forfeit at Ahsoka's site. That's about it, or what am I missing?

The card would feel more balanced if it was immune < 4 or would reduce total bd by one instead of each bd. Adding one to deploy cost would sound fair to me as well.
Last edited by FlorisV on November 24th, 2019, 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by SmallDarkLines »

Agreed with the deploy cost - she feels on the cheap side for the stuff she does.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by CRG »

FlorisV wrote:
November 24th, 2019, 9:21 am
And with Jedi Biz you can give her two sabers to turn any location into a chop shop. I know this is much less of a big deal. The Jedi saber doesn't reduce forfeit and Jedi Biz is limited to specific decks, some of which can't even play Ahsoka.
Rebel Ahsoka lacks an EP1 icon. She goes lost in a Jedi Biz-started deck.

I’m generally not a fan of jedi being deploy 5 (non-v Obi or EPP Obi, but I get that vs Vader) or forfeit 7 (e.g. Master Qui-Gon (V).) so agree she does seem to cost one too few. I realize making her forfeit 8 effectively makes her forfeit 9 given her text (which is LSJK or Obi (V) level).

As for sabers, she doesn’t have a matching saber yet (a two-dot Ashoka Tano’s Lightsaber that cumulatively adds to drains would be cool) and the cumulative rule prevents Jedi Lightsaber v from adding drains. Maybe her and Weapon Lev, Weapon of a Fallen Mentor, etc. could be good. I see weapon usage not an issue yet.

I like her can’t-be-targeted text, give the prevalence of (generally) splashable EPP’s.

Making her immune <4 also seems quite reasonable. Not sure how design would feel having that level of immunity on a Jedi. That’s more of Padawan/ability 5 character immunity.
Last edited by CRG on November 24th, 2019, 10:17 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by Corran »

FlorisV wrote:
November 24th, 2019, 9:21 am
Felt a bit premature to submit this as a Competitive Balance issue and we're already awaiting some serious changes to a bunch of decks but still. While we have more overpowered cards in the game...doesn't this card look like it's going to be a problem? You can't kill her with 4-Lom or Epp Maul (ok fine). As for Cad Bane, just add a character for forfeit and DS stil needs to draw a 2 at least if Dengar shoots the other one(s)...

Oh and then there's I Can Take Care Of Myself. It's just very hard to kill her by conventional means. OK you can run Imperial Justice v and track a 5. Or try to overpower. Or run A Day Long Remembered v which prevents you from EPP shooting at extra forfeit at Ahsoka's site. That's about it, or what am I missing?

And with Jedi Biz you can give her two sabers to turn any location into a chop shop. I know this is much less of a big deal. The Jedi saber doesn't reduce forfeit and Jedi Biz is limited to specific decks, some of which can't even play Ahsoka.

The card would feel more balanced if it was immune < 4 or would reduce total bd by one instead of each bd. Adding one to deploy cost would sound fair to me as well.
I feel like she's a solidly powerful card that's pretty balanced. Her being a Rebel Jedi without an Episode I icon or any deployment restrictions does feel like power creep, but it also opens up strategies. I really want to build a Girl Power deck with all of the Female mains. It would just be nice if they had a little more synergy with each other beyond I Can Take Care of Myself.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by dorshe1 »

FlorisV wrote:
November 24th, 2019, 9:21 am
She goes lost in a Jedi Biz-started deck.


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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by FlorisV »

dorshe1 wrote:
November 24th, 2019, 10:57 am
FlorisV wrote:
November 24th, 2019, 9:21 am
She goes lost in a Jedi Biz-started deck.


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This is true right now. I've removed the comment since it's not a really important argument anyway.

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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by AdmiralHarkov »

She seems fine to me. She doesn't carry a lightsaber. Should all light side characters be easily clearable? Even 1v1 vs EPP Maul which is like her greatest matchup, maul still survives if phantom menace is out and she dies if you play IHYN or Maul Strikes.
She's strongest alone when she can take advantage of her immunity to weapons but nothing special for a large battle when you can just target someone else.

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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by arebelspy »

She's power creep. At the top of the cirve in the current meta, wouldn't survive a reset. Enjoy her for another couple years.

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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by marines28 »

arebelspy wrote:
November 25th, 2019, 10:00 am
She's power creep. At the top of the cirve in the current meta, wouldn't survive a reset. Enjoy her for another couple years.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by sjacree »

arebelspy wrote:
November 25th, 2019, 10:00 am
She's power creep. At the top of the cirve in the current meta, wouldn't survive a reset. Enjoy her for another couple years.
Her deploy is one too low according to guidelines. The guidelines exist for a reason. Other than that, the BD -1 effectively makes her immune less than 6, which with all the BD adders in the game, shouldn't be anything that DS can't overcome.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by Corran »

arebelspy wrote:
November 25th, 2019, 10:00 am
She's power creep. At the top of the cirve in the current meta, wouldn't survive a reset. Enjoy her for another couple years.
Agreed. Of course the other side is that Ahsoka should be a strong card. She's one of my favorite characters, especially her grown up version from Rebels. I was super bummed to come back to the game and see EPP Ahsoka was so underwhelming.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by sac89837 »

sjacree wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 8:20 am
Her deploy is one too low according to guidelines. The guidelines exist for a reason.
Too stifle creativity? Sorry couldn't resist.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by Hazardville »

sac89837 wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 10:31 am
sjacree wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 8:20 am
Her deploy is one too low according to guidelines. The guidelines exist for a reason.
Too stifle creativity? Sorry couldn't resist.
Maybe I’m just bad at looking, but where are these guidelines posted? If they’re not publicly available, then I don’t know how we can be expected to know that a card violates them.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by Echo Base Trooper »

Hazardville wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 11:35 am
sac89837 wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 10:31 am
sjacree wrote:
November 26th, 2019, 8:20 am
Her deploy is one too low according to guidelines. The guidelines exist for a reason.
Too stifle creativity? Sorry couldn't resist.
Maybe I’m just bad at looking, but where are these guidelines posted? If they’re not publicly available, then I don’t know how we can be expected to know that a card violates them.
I think they are only posted publicly in the 10th Anniversary Design Contest:
viewtopic.php?p=635524#p635524

That post hasn't been updated recently so it might not all match current guidelines, but the relevant part to this discussion does match the current guidelines:
Deploy:
Deploy is the average of power and ability (Rounded up)
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by sjacree »

There are updated guidelines and they are found here (viewtopic.php?f=282&t=64089). D&D can and does fudge on these guidelines at times, but they should be the ones to know (based on feedback from playtesting) when that is appropriate.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by Shewski »

I will say that a TON of the errata that we have experienced has to do with us not following the guidelines. It happened when I was around, and it apparently still happens nowadays.
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Re: Rebel Ahsoka

Post by JarJarDrinks »

This card is fun.
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