We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

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Tbiesty
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We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

Post by Tbiesty »

We Have A Prisoner
Use 1 Force if opponent just lost or forfeited a character from battle. Character is captured instead. OR Use X Force to capture all characters aboard a captured starship, where X = twice the number of characters.

All Wrapped Up
Deploy on your side of table. We Have A Prisoner and Oo-ta Goo-ta Solo? play for free and are immune to Sense. Also, whenever opponent forfeits a character, your bounty hunter present may capture that character. (Immune to Alter.)

What're You Tryin' To Push On Us?
Use 3 Force to deploy on table and stack one just-played interrupt here. To play any new Interrupt of the same name, player must first stack it here and use +1 Force for each Interrupt in stack, even if Interrupt is normally free. (Immune to Control.)

Draw Their Fire
Deploy on your side of table. Whenever a battle is initiated, player initiating battle retrieves 1 Force and defender loses 1 Force. Also, during a battle you initiate, each time opponent plays an interrupt, opponent must first use 1 Force. (Immune to Alter.)

Bacta Tank (or cards like Old Ben, etc.)
Use 4 Force to deploy on your side of table. A non-droid character you just lost may be placed here instead of Lost Pile. Holds 1 'patient' at a time. During your deploy phase, may use X Force to bring 'patient' to hand, where X = deploy cost of 'patient.'


A few questions about We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up:

1) If All Wrapped Up, What're You Tryin' To Push On Us? (with 1 copy of We Have A Prisoner currently stacked), and Draw Their Fire (during owner's initiated battle) are on the table, how is the Force used calculated? Basically I'm wondering if What're You Tryin' To Push On Us? and/or Draw Their Fire fall outside of what is covered by "play for free".

2) Based on what I read in the AR, We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up trigger before the character is placed in the Lost Pile (the cards attached to that character are not lost), but cards like Bacta Tank and Old Ben trigger after the character has been placed in the Lost Pile (the cards that were on that character are lost). Are they actually different timings on these cards, so someone could play We Have A Prisoner (have it canceled), and then try to play another We Have A Prisoner before the other player can try to play Old Ben or use the Bacta Tank? Hopefully that makes sense.

3) Can We Have A Prisoner be used to capture a character that was on a ship, if the ship was forfeited, since that causes the character to be lost?


Troy Biesterfeld - Rochester, MN

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Re: We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

Post by Gergall »

1. "What're You Tryin' To Push On Us?" and "Draw Their Fire" each create new separate costs. They do NOT modify the cost printed on We Have A Prisoner.

All Wrapped Up only makes the WHAP cost free. It does not affect the other separate costs.

So for example, in a battle LS initiated, DS wants to play WHAP. He'll be faced with the following costs:
-Stack on WYTTPOU and pay 2 for that
-Pay 1 for Draw Their Fire
-The cost on WHAP itself is free

DS will need 3 Force saved to pay WHAP.

2. The timings are not different. Bacta Tank and WHAP are both responses to the character being "just forfeited" or "just lost" which means they directly compete with each other. WHAP just happens to have a special weird exception to the rules that the character will keep weapons/devices/etc. Same for All Wrapped Up

3. Yes, the character is lost, so you can use WHAP to capture.
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Re: We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

Post by Tbiesty »

ok, based on that I think I need a little more clarification about item 2, since I'm trying to understand the timing so I can program this. :-D

Since the timing is the same, then these things all happen after the character is placed in the Lost Pile, it's just that with We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up that the character gets the weapons, etc. cards back on them when returned to the table?

Here's a sequence:
1) Light side forfeits character with an attached weapon from a site.
2) Light side places cards in Lost Pile
3) (Dark side passes "just lost" response)
4) Light side uses Crash Site Memorial's "just lost" response to stack the "just lost" weapon there.
5) Dark side plays We Have A Prisoner to capture "just lost" prisoner, which returns the character (but without the weapon since it is no longer in Lost Pile) to the site for capture.

Would that work?
Troy Biesterfeld - Rochester, MN

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Re: We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

Post by Gergall »

Because the character and weapon are lost simultaneously, it is possible to respond to the weapon being lost before responding to the character being lost (AR "Leaves Table" entry + "Simultaneous" entry).

That creates a really interesting question about WHAP, so I'd like to bring it to the rules team for review. Sorry for the wait.
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Re: We Have A Prisoner and All Wrapped Up

Post by Lukes Bionic Hand »

Sorry for the absurdly long wait on this one. This ruling took a long time to be worked out, went through several revisions, and was then delayed in posting for some time (my fault).

The final ruling is that anything removed before We Have A Prisoner or All Wrapped Up capture a character remains removed, even though this causes some metaphysical weirdness with regard to when a card (and other cards on it) is actually in the lost pile. The "just lost" exception for these cards is still in place, and as such, cards will remain on the card in question when captured (as long as they are not removed by a just response before the capture).

I'll quote the relevant part of the ruling from the Current Rulings thread here:
Appendix B

All Wrapped Up
When capturing a just forfeited character using this Dark Side Effect, that character is captured after applying forfeit value but before being placed on the Lost Pile. When captured, the character's values that would normally be restored upon leaving table (e.g., forfeit being reduced by 2, power being reduced to 0) has those values reset. In this way, cards deployed on that character (for example, Bounty or a weapon) are not placed in the Lost Pile. Additionally, if the card was 'hit', it is no longer 'hit'. However, if any responses to the character being lost remove a card (or cards) on that character prior to this card being used to capture them, any removed card(s) would not return to the character and would stay where they were placed when removed. This is a specific exception to the just lost ruling.
This card merely requires that the bounty hunter be present at the location. He need not be present with the forfeited character.

We Have A Prisoner
When capturing a just forfeited character using this Dark Side Interrupt, that character is captured after applying forfeit value but before being placed on the Lost Pile. When captured, the characters values that would normally be restored upon leaving table (e.g., forfeit being reduced by 2, power being reduced to 0) has those values reset. In this way, cards deployed on that character (for example, Bounty or a weapon) are not placed in the Lost Pile. Additionally, if the card was 'hit', it is no longer 'hit'. However, if any responses to the character being lost remove a card (or cards) on that character prior to this card being played to capture them, any removed card(s) would not return to the character and would stay where they were placed when removed. This is a specific exception to the just lost ruling.
This Interrupt's first function may capture a character lost or forfeited from a system or sector, if you have a potential escort available aboard a vehicle or starship at that location.

EDIT: small grammar fix
The Smoking Gungan wrote:worf plays for canada even though that team has no honor and plays dirty
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