kavanaugh

mikefrench
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by mikefrench »

wrt corroboration:

https://twitter.com/JaneMayerNYer/statu ... 8596440065

context - kavanaugh's lawyers issued a statement from 6 former classmates at yale disputing the ramirez incident. 2 of those classmates have now withdrawn from that statement, which leaves 4 people; one random classmate, 2 people implicated in the incident, and the wife of another person implicated in the event.


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Re: RE: Re: kavanaugh

Post by Hari Seldon »

mikefrench wrote:wrt corroboration:

https://twitter.com/JaneMayerNYer/statu ... 8596440065

context - kavanaugh's lawyers issued a statement from 6 former classmates at yale disputing the ramirez incident. 2 of those classmates have now withdrawn from that statement, which leaves 4 people; one random classmate, 2 people implicated in the incident, and the wife of another person implicated in the event.
Correct, but they both still say they either never saw or heard about it, and/or it's out of character for Kavanaugh. They pulled their names though because they were not present so they can't directly dispute the allegation. Which makes two people (three including Kavanaugh) alleged to have participated in the event that said it didn't happen, and they still haven't found anybody there other than Ramirez that said it did.

All of Ramirez's corroboration comes from individuals that were not there, so I guess they should pull their support too based on the same standard as above (doh!). There's two hearsay accounts, one person who does say he heard about the event second or third hand and knows the details of when, what, and who, and a second person that basically heard details of an event like Ramirez describes, but not who did what or where or when.

No matter how you slice it, you can't find an intellectually honest journalist that will say it's good sourced reporting in regards to the allegation. Which is why it's titled "Senate Democrats Investigate a New Allegation of Sexual Misconduct, from Brett Kavanaugh’s College Years" because the magazine can then get away with saying they are just reporting on the Democrats' investigation. The goal though is to get it out there as a smear. Although most of Twitter that I follow, which is not a huge group and overwhelmingly conservative to be fair, thinks it hurts Dr. Ford since it's such shoddy reporting that it casts doubt on her allegation by association.

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allstarz97 wrote:...and thematically, as everyone is referencing on this thread, why are people not mentioning the part where mace windu is crying like a little *, gets his hand cut off and then gets thrown out a window?

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by mikefrench »

all due respect, we disagree, and i'm not interested in walking through it all with you
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by mikefrench »

The Honky Tonk Man wrote:If you want to post trash takes, at least go the Mike French route and come off as being somewhat reasonable.

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Gergall »

Testimony from the 3rd accuser posted here:
https://twitter.com/MichaelAvenatti/sta ... 8730843136

I found a text version that I could copy and paste here. The text version skipped the first 7 points because they weren't as important (you can read them using the link above).
Declaration of Julie Swetnick

I, JULIE SWETNICK, declare as follows:

\8. I observed Brett Kavanaugh drink excessively at many of these parties and engage in abusive and physically aggressive behavior toward girls, including pressing girls against him without their consent, "grinding" against girls, and attempting to remove or shift girls' clothing to expose private body parts. I likewise observed him be verbally abusive towards girls by making crude sexual comments to them that were designed to demean, humiliate and embarrass them. I often witnessed Brett Kavanaugh speak in a demeaning manner about girls in general as well as specific girls by name. I also witnessed Brett Kavanaugh behave as a "mean drunk" on many occassions at these parties.

\9. I have been told by other women that this conduct also occurred during the Summer months in Ocean City, Maryland on numerous occasions. I also witnessed such conduct on one occasion in Ocean City, Maryland during "Beach Week."

\10. I have reviewed Brett Kavanaugh's recent claim on Fox News regarding his alleged "innocence" during his high school years and lack of sexual activity. This claim is absolutely false and a lie. I witnessed Brett Kavanaugh consistently engage in excessive drinking and inappropriate contact of a sexual nature with women during the early 1980s.

\11. During the years 1981-82, I became aware of efforts by Mark Judge, Brett Kavanaugh and others to "spike" the "punch" at house parties I attended with drugs and/or grain alcohol so as to cause girls to lose their inhibitions and their ability to say "No." This caused me to make an effort to purposely avoid the "punch" at these parties. I witnessed efforts by Mark Judge, Brett Kavanaugh and others to "target" particular girls so they could be taken advantage of; it was usually a girl that was especially vulnerable because she was alone at the party or shy.

\12. I also witnessed efforts by Mark Judge, Brett Kavanaugh and others to cause girls to become inebriated and disoriented so they could then be "gang raped" in a side room or bedroom by a "train" of numerous boys. I have a firm recollection of seeing boys lined up outside rooms at many of these parties waiting for their "turn" with a girl inside the room. These boys included Mark Judge and Brett Kavanaugh.

\13. In approximately 1982, I became the victim of one of these "gang" or "train" rapes where Mark Judge and Brett Kavanaugh were present. Shortly after the incident, I shared what had transpired with at least two other people. During the incident, I was incapacitated without my consent and unable to fight off the boys raping me. I believe I was drugged using Quaaludes or something similar placed in what I was drinking.

\14. I am aware of other witnesses that can attest to the truthfulness of each of the statements above.

I declare, under penalty of perjury and under the laws of the United States of America, that the foregoing is true and correct. I have executed this declaration on September 25, 2018.
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Hari Seldon »

It's crazy, I don't know what's going on here. There's no way Kavanaugh himself pulls his nomination now, he's got to fight these allegations as they are life in prison type crimes. Lots of questions raised by the statement, but short of the victim herself refuting the testimony or something I don't know how they are voting him out of committee Friday and/or on the Senate floor Monday on Tuesday as planned. Probably not voting him in at all. Trump seems to be resolved to stick with him based on his initial comments so I wouldn't expect him to pull the nomination though.

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allstarz97 wrote:...and thematically, as everyone is referencing on this thread, why are people not mentioning the part where mace windu is crying like a little *, gets his hand cut off and then gets thrown out a window?

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Aglets »

No way Kavanaugh gives in.

No way Trump gives in.

Assuming the hearing actually happens tomorrow, I think we'll have a better idea how the potential swing votes will go. Unless Kavanaugh screws up royally or if Ford performs incredibly well with air tight answers and perhaps additional evidence I would expect Rs to try and still push him through.
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by JarJarDrinks »

So looks like my initial reaction to the first claim was incorrect. All signs point to kavanaugh being a literal rapist.
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Re: kavanaugh

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The exchange between Hirono and CNN's Tapper, about 3 minutes in:
Tapper: Doesn't Kavanaugh have the same presumption of innocence as anyone else in America?

Hirono: I put his denial in the context of everything that I know about him in terms of how he approaches his cases. As I said, his credibility is already very questionable in my mind and in the minds of a lot of my fellow Judiciary Committee members, the Democrats. So he comes, and -- when I say that he's very outcome-driven, he has an ideological agenda, is very outcome-driven. And I can sit here and talk to you about some of the cases that exemplifies his, in my view, inability to be fair in the cases that come before him. This is a person that is going to be sitting on our Supreme Court, making decisions that will impact women's reproductive choice. He has a -- he very much is against women's reproductive choice.
https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/201 ... o-full.cnn
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Hobbie »

Maybe he's just pro-unalienable rights...

Like ya know, life...and stuff

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Hobbie »

But seriously, that's a Democrat saying "I wont vote for him because he's probably against abortion." Isnt the committee just to make sure he's qualified for the position? And, as someone who's been on the "second most powerful court in america" for 12 years, he is.
Is he qualified as a human being? I dont know. Did he gang rape people in high school? I dont know. That is a serious allegation to bring tho and she needs to name every person who "stood in line outside the door" so all their lives can be ruined as well. The school probably needs to be shut down as it promotes a horrendous culture .
But, we apparently have super low standards for the morals of our politicians. So, why should our judges be different?

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by AdmiralMotti89 »

Hobbie wrote:But seriously, that's a Democrat saying "I wont vote for him because he's probably against abortion."
To me it seems a lot worse than that. It's not just voting against him, it's about refusing the presumption of innocence until proof of guilt to him because of how he goes about deciding cases. That first sentence especially is a doozy.
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by mikefrench »

It really is, so long as you ignore that he lied to the senate multiple times earlier in his career, and that his first statement after trump’s announcement was a fawning lie. I posted about these things earlier in this thread and no one engaged on it.
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Re: kavanaugh

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Is there even one contemporary witness who was at ANY of these parties in question that has corroborated ANY of the allegations?

I'm trying to be open minded that I'm missing something here.
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by JarJarDrinks »

Aglets wrote:Is there even one contemporary witness who was at ANY of these parties in question that has corroborated ANY of the allegations?

I'm trying to be open minded that I'm missing something here.
well the Rs produced 2 dudes this morning that are claiming that it was THEM that actually sexually assaulted ford and not kavanaugh/judge.
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Re: kavanaugh

Post by Aglets »

Yeah I'm not sure what to make of that. Doesn't seem like normal human behavior.
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Rian Johnson wrote: I would be worried if everybody across the board was like "Yea, that was a good movie." It's much more exciting to me when you get a group of people who are coming up to you.....really really excited about it. And then there are other people who walk out literally saying that was the worst movie I've ever seen. Having those two extremes to me is the mark of the type of movie that I want to make.

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Re: kavanaugh

Post by JarJarDrinks »

I'd say I'm right around 50/50 on whether or not he gets confirmed.

Also split on whether I'd prefer it or not.
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Re: RE: Re: kavanaugh

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Aglets wrote:Is there even one contemporary witness who was at ANY of these parties in question that has corroborated ANY of the allegations?

I'm trying to be open minded that I'm missing something here.
No, not that I am aware. And Dr. Ford seems sincere, I don't see anything happening during her questioning that will hurt her credibility.

So it will come down to whether one credible allegation of sexual assault from when he was 17 that can't be corroborated at all is enough to keep Kavanaugh off the Supreme Court. Republicans are between a rock and hard place here.

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allstarz97 wrote:...and thematically, as everyone is referencing on this thread, why are people not mentioning the part where mace windu is crying like a little *, gets his hand cut off and then gets thrown out a window?

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Re: RE: Re: kavanaugh

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mikefrench wrote:It really is, so long as you ignore that he lied to the senate multiple times earlier in his career, and that his first statement after trump’s announcement was a fawning lie. I posted about these things earlier in this thread and no one engaged on it.
Not sure about what the lie after Trumps announcement means, but all kinds of media outlets have fact checked the * out of the claims of lying to the senate earlier in his career and nothing holds water. I presume most in this thread know that as to why you didn't get any engagement.

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allstarz97 wrote:...and thematically, as everyone is referencing on this thread, why are people not mentioning the part where mace windu is crying like a little *, gets his hand cut off and then gets thrown out a window?

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Re: RE: Re: kavanaugh

Post by mikefrench »

Hari Seldon wrote:all kinds of media outlets have fact checked the * out of the claims of lying to the senate earlier in his career and nothing holds water.
this is not true. please provide sources.

kavanaugh's blatant dishonesty (i posted about this on page 10 of this thread): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwgYl9n ... u.be&t=513
Brett Kavanaugh wrote:Throughout this process, I’ve witnessed firsthand your appreciation for the vital role of the American judiciary. No President has ever consulted more widely, or talked with more people from more backgrounds, to seek input about a Supreme Court nomination.
it's fawning, it's silly, it's something that is impossible for kavanaugh to have anything close to definitive knowledge about.

as to the mazie hirono quote that got some of you all bent out of shape - she is accurately describing kavanaugh. he is outcome driven. he has been a republican political operative his entire life. those are true statements of clear facts. combine that with his history of dishonesty and it's not a hard nomination to oppose.
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