SPOILERS: STAR WARS: EPISODE 9: THE RISE OF SKYWALKERS [SPOILERS]

[Spoiler Man]

So, there's been several spoiler threads that have gone around the internet, primarily on Reddit and GameFAQs, and ....everything is pointing at them being fully reliable and authentic. Disney has even laid down copyrights on the imaging and postings that people have made. And the spoilers came out before the final trailer and stuff in the spoilers were in the trailer. So its definitely looking like it's legit.

I'm going to upload the image of the spoilers:

https://ibb.co/GdwjLKR

Spoilers:
Big Take Aways:

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Big Take Aways:
* Kylo Ren turns good
* Kylo Ren dies (somewhat unceremoniously too)
* Emperor isn't fully explained
* Rey is the granddaughter of the Emperor
* Rey's parents didn't abandon her, they left her on Jakku to hide her from the Emperor (ala hiding Luke on Tatooine), but they are found and killed
* Rey uses the title of Skywalker, at the end, in a fashion similar to that of Jedi, something I think a lot of people called - that Skywalker =/= Jedi going forward
* There is a few "fake deaths" - Chewie and C3PO
* Snoke isn't fully explained, but is mentioned as being an apprentice to the Emperor after the death of Vader
* Leia dies of old age
* Luke does not get reincarnated
* Ending scene is ROTJ ending 2.0

Spoilers:
My Thoughts:

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Brief thoughts:
1) This whole movie just sounds laughably bad. Which is kind of what we all knew going in I think. I am amazed at just how much of the ball was dropped for this trilogy. And how much can we put at the feet of Kennedy or Johnson or other execs? Did Johnson changing so much up in TLJ and leaving no setup for TROS really screw things up?
2) The idea of the Emperor back is both ok/bad. If he was used in Ep7 it wouldn't have been too bad maybe? But being in the 3rd of this trilogy, and with how badly received and reviewed TLJ was, it reeks of desperation. But they could have made it an interesting angle.
3) I definitely think the idea that Rey is the grand daughter of Emperor Palpatine was a last second idea.
4) I think we all called the idea that Skywalker was going to be new term for Jedi going forward if they ever do decide to make EP10+
5) I don't know where this movie leaves the universe as a whole. Where does DnD's set of movies take place? How will they factor in? Will this hurt/make better The Mandalorian (honestly the only SW thing I'm looking forward to)?
6) Snoke .... well, this completely makes him irrelevant and pointless as a character. We find out he was an apprentice that the Emperor found after Vader. And that the Emperor distilled in him just a complete hatred for Luke; thus why he turns Kylo and why he has that seemingly pointed hatred for Luke. Its also revealed that the Emperor basically used him to setup a war (ala Clone Wars) to buy himself time to reveal himself for a final assault and attempt at getting Rey to turn to the dark side and for him to regain control of the galaxy. YAWN
7) Sadly, after TLJ and Solo (which - TLJ was horrible, and Solo wasn't bad, but not good enough and not what we needed/I wanted in a SW movie) I knew going in that I was going to be upset by this movie, and kind of have a "hate-watch" approach to it. And these spoilers basically just confirm that.

So whats all of your thoughts? Has anyone else read the spoilers (before this thread)? What are your thoughts after reading the spoilers? Looking forward to the movie MORE or LESS now?

[hanotsri]

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I think the summary from JediPraxis on r/starwarsleaks is the most complete spoiler picture. Its generally in sync with what Jason at MSW and Bespin News have been getting from their sources. It comes down to this is quite possibly the greatest leak of a major motion picture of all time...or the greatest hoax of all time where three separate sources worked together to make it seem like they're getting this information independently of each other from sources in LFL or Bad Robot

After seeing the final trailer, I have no doubt that these spoilers are largely legit and the movies has largely been spoiled. I am sure there is a lot of context and nuances missing that help the flow of things.

I'll post my thoughts on the spoilers later.

[shawnd1984]

Holy f'ing lame.

[shawnd1984]

Holy f'ing lame.

But props to Disney for hiring 7th graders to write their scripts.

[hanotsri]

Holy f'ing lame.

But props to Disney for hiring 7th graders to write their scripts.

I mean the original trilogy isn't much better

[shawnd1984]

Holy f'ing lame.

But props to Disney for hiring 7th graders to write their scripts.

I mean the original trilogy isn't much better

Maybe. Except they couldn't piggyback on nostalgia to rope our gullible asses back in.

[Spoiler Man]

Yea, this is a whole lot of hot garbage.

[AdmiralMotti89]

Read the first line of the spoiler tagged part and immediately closed it, although from the previews that is hardly surprising. I think I am done with the spoilers until the movie because I can always complain about the film after it punches me in the gut without warning instead of steeling myself up for it like you guys.

But man do I really want to know what the griping is about...

[Cam Solusar]

So, there's been several spoiler threads that have gone around the internet, primarily on Reddit and GameFAQs, and ....everything is pointing at them being fully reliable and authentic. Disney has even laid down copyrights on the imaging and postings that people have made. And the spoilers came out before the final trailer and stuff in the spoilers were in the trailer. So its definitely looking like it's legit.

Spoiler

Show

Big Take Aways:
* Kylo Ren turns good
* Kylo Ren dies (somewhat unceremoniously too)
* Emperor isn't fully explained
* Rey is the granddaughter of the Emperor
* Rey's parents didn't abandon her, they left her on Jakku to hide her from the Emperor (ala hiding Luke on Tatooine), but they are found and killed
* Rey uses the title of Skywalker, at the end, in a fashion similar to that of Jedi, something I think a lot of people called - that Skywalker =/= Jedi going forward
* There is a few "fake deaths" - Chewie and C3PO
* Snoke isn't fully explained, but is mentioned as being an apprentice to the Emperor after the death of Vader
* Leia dies of old age
* Luke does not get reincarnated
* Ending scene is ROTJ ending 2.0

My thoughts regarding the above bullet points:

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1) I think Kylo Ren turning back to the light (and dying) makes sense for his character arc, and effectively closes the circle on the idea of the Skywalker(s) bringing balance to the force.
2) Emperor being unexplained is a bit worrisome, as it seems pretty obvious that he died in ROTJ. I'd hope for at least some sort of lampshading of his return, at minimum.
3) Rey being Palpatine's granddaughter is a theory that has been floated since before TFA (not sure how you came to the conclusion that it is a new thing). Of all the "Rey is related to X" theories that have been floating around, it is the most palatable to me, second only to her truly being Nobody, so if this is the case I'm happy.
4) Rey's parents being quasi-retconned is fine. The OT is so full of retcons that one or two in the ST are not going to bother me. Could always be spun as "Kylo was lying or Kylo was deceived/misinformed and gave Rey what he believed to be the truth."
5) Skywalker = new term for Jedi = fine with me.
6) Fake deaths, fine. We've had plenty of high impact real deaths, so a couple fake ones will be a change from what we've been used to. I wonder if Lando will survive.
7) Snoke being handwaved as an apprentice of Emperor seems fine. We never got detailed in-movie explanation of Maul or Dooku's backgrounds, you just accept that they're the bad guy of the movie, subservient to Sidious, and move on. Same with Vader, really. He's just a one-dimensional lackey until ESB when he isn't.
8) Leia dying of old age seems implausible. I have a hard time seeing how they'd do this effectively with archive footage.
9) Not sure why we'd want to see Luke get reincarnated.
10) Makes sense that it would end similarly to RotJ.

Ultimately, I think any shortcomings of the trilogy lay squarely at the feet of JJ Abrams. The further I've been distanced time-wise from TFA the less I've liked it. It's a fine movie for movie's sake, but I think it is a slave to its nostalgia in a way that TLJ managed to avoid. By comparison, the nostalgia in Rogue One was well-placed because it was a prequel that slotted nicely into the OT timeline. I think TLJ saved the trilogy in my mind by taking the risks that it did, etching a new type of story into the Star Wars canon, and showing how the envelope can be pushed in the future. It may not be the movie that the crusty old fanboys wanted, but I think it was the the movie that Star Wars as a franchise needed, lest Star Wars become a Marvel 2.0 franchise movie mass-production conveyor belt. Coming up on two years later I would still say it's my favorite SW movie.

Regarding TROS, I am looking forward to it. Given JJ Abram's involvement I'm wary, but by what I've seen so far I'm cautiously optimistic that this isn't just going to be ROTJ 2.0 in the same way that TFA was ANH 2.0. I like seeing B-Wings again, seeing capital ships in battle, and the fact that Wedge is returning. The emotional beats shown in the trailers seem on point.

[rsersen]

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Not sure how I feel about Rey being a Palpatine...will need to wait and see what exposition/context they give on this. Assuming that Palpatine "influenced the midichlorians to create life" in some random couple, and they gave birth to Rey? Does that actually make her Palpatine's blood then? How did her parents figure out that Palpatine was behind this (assuming they knew enough to want to hide her)? Lot of questions, and the answers we get (if any) will be key.

I think I'm more upset that about Palpatine being the "big bad" of this trilogy. We watched him in that role in the OT.....and then being the mastermind of the prequels...now it turns out that he was masterminding this trilogy too? It's a little ridiculous at this point, especially when you think about the fact that he's been in control across three different eras, but somehow couldn't account for Ewoks.

I was pumped to see him in this movie, but wanted to see more of a cameo from a force presence/ghost who remained attached to the ruins of the DSII....not having to believe that he somehow survived the fall down a reactor shaft (and subsequent explosion) and then stayed in hiding assembling yet another master plan that fails.

Gonna hope that a lot of these are red herrings of some kind, because otherwise it's an underwhelming end to an overall disappointing trilogy.

[hanotsri]

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Before I get into my thoughts on the spoilers, I first want to address this:

and with how badly received and reviewed TLJ was

How about you course correct your statement by saying "how divisive TLJ was" instead? It certainly wasn't badly reviewed and you can say it was badly received by half the fandom, but all that means is the movie is divisive. For whatever reason, this divisiveness deteriorated into downright vitriol and that makes me sad. I loved the movie and I know just as many who loved it as who didn't. So let's stop kidding ourselves by suggesting Star Wars fandom, as a whole, hated the movie as that is simply not true.

Moving on...

Admittedly, when they announced at Celebration that Palpatine was going to be the bad guy in the film, I was a bit distraught about it. I made the assumption that when Supreme Leader Snoke and Kylo Ren were introduced and were clearly identified as not being Sith, that Lucasfilm was doing the right thing by making them some other dark side cult. Anakin Skywalker's whole purpose and prophecy of being was to bring balance to the Force and destroy the Sith. He supposedly accomplished that on the second Death Star. Anything that suggests he did not accomplished that, I find to be extremely frustrating.

I really hope (not revealed in the leaks) that Anakin Skywalker still has some part to play in destroying this resurgent Emperor. I don't know how it could be done, but I really need to have him be involved in some way.

Regarding how Palpatine survived, I have no answers and it was clear JediPraxis, Jason from MSW, and Bespin don't have them either. I simply don't want him to be a clone. This sequel trilogy has already had enough influences from the Dark Empire comic book series: the Supreme Leader moniker, the very notion of Force Projection, and now an Emperor reborn. Please...please...please don't make him a clone.

Regarding Rey's parentage, the Sith dagger, etc. I hope that J.J. doesn't spend too much time drawing that storyline out. If I am being honest, I'd prefer Rey just be a no one, but I understand that certain fans aren't going to be happy knowing who she was or where she came from. The question is will they like the Palpatine's granddaughter angle? Who knows. I also have reservations about a Palpatine taking on the Skywalker name.

I don't think anyone thought that Kylo wouldn't be redeemed by the end, I expected it even though I would really prefer he remained evil until the very end. Why do we need a redemption arc? Some people are just bad. Let him be bad.

I was really looking forward to the supposed flashback scene where a younger Luke and Leia are training with lightsabers and Leia tells Luke that she is pregnant and will be giving up the training. That would take some serious CGI, but I think it could be beautifully done.

I really hope that Denis Lawson returns as Wedge as Rebel Force Radio has suggested they confirmed (the fact that Wedge is in the Resistance Reborn book is a great sign).

I also really hope that all of the groundwork laid in the written canon regarding Palpatine's Contingency has some sort of mention.

[Cam Solusar]

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I read an excerpt from that book and apparently in the TLJ era Wedge has married Snap Wexley's mother and settled down on a quiet planet.

[Cam Solusar]

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Finished the Rise of Resistance book last night. It was OK. Felt like 1/3 of an X-Wing series novel. Poe was fleshed out decently, as were Leia and Finn. Rey and Rose were very much secondary characters. Lots of POV sections by people I had never heard of and didn't care about.

Notable appearances of non-obvious people who may return in tRoS:

Orrimaarko
General Rieekan (unfortunately the actor from ESB passed away in 2004)
Wedge Antilles
Norra Wexley
Snap Wexley
Jessika Pava

Thus continues the general disappointment of non-movie non-comic SW content.

[Spoiler Man]

Someone watched the "Star Wars Explained" video about this topic. Am I right Cam?

[Cam Solusar]

Someone watched the "Star Wars Explained" video about this topic. Am I right Cam?

I don't think I did, no. Just read the one novel.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

[hanotsri]

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Finished the Rise of Resistance book last night. It was OK. Felt like 1/3 of an X-Wing series novel. Poe was fleshed out decently, as were Leia and Finn. Rey and Rose were very much secondary characters. Lots of POV sections by people I had never heard of and didn't care about.

Notable appearances of non-obvious people who may return in tRoS:

Orrimaarko
General Rieekan (unfortunately the actor from ESB passed away in 2004)
Wedge Antilles
Norra Wexley
Snap Wexley
Jessika Pava

Thus continues the general disappointment of non-movie non-comic SW content.

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I disagree. I loved the book. I thought it did a fantastic job of tying so many strands of the post-ROTj narrative over the last few years. Aftermath, Battlefront II, Bloodline, Poe Dameron comics, AND gave us a sense of how the Resistance recovers. Loved seeing Shriv and Say, Ransolm Casterfo, Wedge Antilles, etc etc etc

[hanotsri]

Duplicate post.

[Spoiler Man]

Latest spoiler leak:

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When Palpatine discusses with Rey how she is his granddaughter and how he survived the Death Star Explosion:

SHOCK TWIST - Clones!

DOUBLE SHOCK TWIST - the Emperor that was on the Death Star and gets killed was the clone, and this Emperor; the one Rey is fighting is the legitimate real one!


..... HARD..... EYE.... ROLL.


And for those of you who before thought that the idea of a clone Emperor diminished Vader's moment and triumph and redemption.... this REALLY does it. Its also interesting; never did I think after/when reading Dark Empire or the original plot leak for this that "who / which was the legitimate Emperor". But, now it'll be a constant question. "Who was the legitimate Emperor? How do we know THIS Palpatine is the legitimate one?" It calls into question the "unreliable narrator", just like after a fake-death or a return from death moment, you challenge if/when characters die. Now we'll be challenging if this is the REAL Palpatine and if there are more clones, and when they'll reappear. Because if he made 1 clone, and basically used it as ambush bait at Endor, why wouldn't he have a second clone? Or a third? Or fourth? Etc. If I was able to clone myself as a super super super God like being like Palpatine, I wouldn't stop at 1 or even 10 clones, I'd have at least 50 just in case of issues.

UGH this is so frustrating. So glad I've read the spoilers so I won't be groaning out loud so much during EP9 that it detracts from all the non-jaded fanboys.[/spoilers]

[hanotsri]

Latest spoiler leak:

Spoiler

Show

When Palpatine discusses with Rey how she is his granddaughter and how he survived the Death Star Explosion:

SHOCK TWIST - Clones!

DOUBLE SHOCK TWIST - the Emperor that was on the Death Star and gets killed was the clone, and this Emperor; the one Rey is fighting is the legitimate real one!


..... HARD..... EYE.... ROLL.


And for those of you who before thought that the idea of a clone Emperor diminished Vader's moment and triumph and redemption.... this REALLY does it. Its also interesting; never did I think after/when reading Dark Empire or the original plot leak for this that "who / which was the legitimate Emperor". But, now it'll be a constant question. "Who was the legitimate Emperor? How do we know THIS Palpatine is the legitimate one?" It calls into question the "unreliable narrator", just like after a fake-death or a return from death moment, you challenge if/when characters die. Now we'll be challenging if this is the REAL Palpatine and if there are more clones, and when they'll reappear. Because if he made 1 clone, and basically used it as ambush bait at Endor, why wouldn't he have a second clone? Or a third? Or fourth? Etc. If I was able to clone myself as a super super super God like being like Palpatine, I wouldn't stop at 1 or even 10 clones, I'd have at least 50 just in case of issues.

UGH this is so frustrating. So glad I've read the spoilers so I won't be groaning out loud so much during EP9 that it detracts from all the non-jaded fanboys.[/spoilers]

I don't believe this will be the case, but it's terrible if it is.

This leak comes someone anonymous on 4chan, not any of the previous three leakers.

[hanotsri]

Here is the link for those interested. It reads like terrible fanfiction: https://archive.md/Ajemr