Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by quesosauce37 »

stephengascrub wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 7:44 pm
1.) she gets hurt and then pops up and says okay I'm fine,
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best part of that movie!


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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by Gergall »

stephengascrub wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 7:44 pm
Also, if anyone else except me on these forums likes Attack of the Clones, I'll be shocked.
where's the thread where people rank SW movies?
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by stephengascrub »

quesosauce37 wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 9:41 pm
stephengascrub wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 7:44 pm
1.) she gets hurt and then pops up and says okay I'm fine,
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best part of that movie!
Lol.
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by AdmiralMotti89 »

Proton Torpedoes can't melt power regulators.

That, and
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Green Leader didn't kill himself.
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by rhendon »

maxbeedo wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 9:38 pm
rhendon wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 2:41 pm
It's plot hook with Kreya was a bit more obvious than the hook in KOTOR1 though and that is usually what puts KOTOR1 above 2 for me but the story in KOTOR1 loses replay value when you already know that hook.
Was it obvious? I didn't fully understand her plan to "Destroy the Force" until the very end, and that wasn't even her plan A. The game plays on your expectations of SW media multiple times, by making you think the Council drained your powers (like in KOTOR1), or that Kreia turns out to be a stereotypical Sith villain at the end (she's not). KOTOR1's characters and story were much simpler, which makes it harder to enjoy on future playthroughs, but I do give it credit for coming up with the Jedi and Sith codes and starting some of the conversations on their philosophies that KOTOR2 ran with.
Sorry I mean when Kreia turns. That was more the obvious part. I figured she would turn pretty quickly. That plot hook vs finding out you were Revan all along are pretty different in terms of oh * moments.

So KOTOR1 built up that story all with you not having that knowledge whereas KOTOR2 didn't rely on the plot hook part and just had better chars, conversations, and overall story.

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by Gergall »

quesosauce37 wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 9:41 pm
best part of that movie!
Not joking at all, the next 15-20 seconds where Anakin and Obi-Wan argue about rescuing Padme vs pursuing Dooku, is my favorite part of the movie. I don't like Ep 2 but that argument feels real to me, they did a good job on it.
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by lithy »

Star Wars is better than Empire Strikes Back.

ESB is the best possible outcome for a story that doesn't need a sequel (see Matrix Reloaded for a worst possible outcome), but it still needs the resolution that is given in RotJ to be a complete story so the two are inseparable plot-wise and RotJ is obviously the weakest of the OT. So how can ESB be the best?

Qualifier: The opening all the way through the evacuation of Hoth, and specifically the Battle of Hoth are probably my favorite setting and scenes, but in terms of story, ESB is not a complete story.

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by Gergall »

lithy wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 10:03 am
but in terms of story, ESB is not a complete story.
It's a complete story, you just feel like it needs more because it didn't end with good guys winning.

A movie that ended with a main bad guy getting frozen and the last vestiges of the bad guy army retreating to the outside edges of the galaxy would probably be seen as acceptable, right?

Even "I Am Your Father" is used as a gut punch to Luke, not as a cliffhanger that requires another movie. If you're rooting for the bad guys, this is an awesome ending. Luke is devastated, Han is humiliated, the rebellion is shredded. Good times. The end.
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by DS-61-4 »

Gergall wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 11:00 am
lithy wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 10:03 am
but in terms of story, ESB is not a complete story.
It's a complete story, you just feel like it needs more because it didn't end with good guys winning.

A movie that ended with a main bad guy getting frozen and the last vestiges of the bad guy army retreating to the outside edges of the galaxy would probably be seen as acceptable, right?

Even "I Am Your Father" is used as a gut punch to Luke, not as a cliffhanger that requires another movie. If you're rooting for the bad guys, this is an awesome ending. Luke is devastated, Han is humiliated, the rebellion is shredded. Good times. The end.
Now that is a nice controversial opinion right there!

My controversial opinion is that outside of OT SWCCG lore, no canon has been released since 1996. No prequels, no sequels, no SE. Any lore depicting stuff from any of that also is not canon. Fight me.

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by lastastronaut »

mr007agent wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 4:28 pm
All of the Star Wars movies are pretty bad except for 4 and 5.
Is this controversial? As a fan of film first and Star Wars fan second, I thought this was pretty much the accepted position anywhere outside of crazy fan forums like this ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by lastastronaut »

I don't know if this is controversial (certainly small potatoes compared to some stuff here anyways), but I really liked the prequel trilogy novelizations and thought they told a really compelling story of Palpatine's long con and a convincing narrative for how Vader slipped to the dark side. And every time I saw the movie after reading the novelization I was so disappointed in how terrible of a job they did of translating that story onto the screen.

(disclaimer: that being said, I read those in high school, so with many things, they might not have aged as well as I remember them)

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by hanotsri »

Someone responded to a post I made on Reddit the other day with the following:

One of the most vacuous criticisms of the sequels is the famous incoherency criticism. It is widely believed online that the sequels are this incoherent, illogical story... even though objectively, they are FAR more coherent than the original trilogy ever was.

Everyone has forgotten that The Empire Strikes Back simply threw away huge chunks of its predecessors' story in favor of a completely different, jarringly dark conception and a plot which simply does not follow. Star Wars very clearly established that the Empire desperately needs the Death Star to retain control of the galaxy, as fires of Rebellion are spreading left and right. They have even penetrated the Imperial government itself, and the well-equipped Rebel Alliance is a dangerous threat to the great Imperial starfleet. Star Wars has a very optimistic and hopeful tone, and when the Death Star is destroyed, the movie ends on a jovial note because everyone knows the Empire is doomed now. It's a dark time for the Empire...

Or not, considering that TESB simply ignores all of this and states in the crawl that it's a dark time for the Rebellion, somehow. The great victory from the previous movie is then unceremoniously brushed away in the same crawl with a fricking "although". And then there's also the famous "I'm your father", which was a complete retcon. Vader was simply not Luke's father in Star Wars. There is no suggestion that Obi-Wan was lying because he wasn't.

Then Return of the Jedi had to somehow reconcile the major contradictions, and even in many ways ignore the Empire in favor of going back to the original themes and plot points. This is why there's again a jovial tone at the end after another Death Star is destroyed. And because the story line was terminated prematurely, Return had to retcon Luke's sister into being Leia. The twist from TESB is preserved, but Return again shifts the tone into a more optimistic one, bringing up the notion of redemption for Vader, which was not at all hinted at in the past two movies.

Opinions on the originals were far more nuanced in the past, but as time went on and intense nostalgia began clouding the minds of fans, audiences, and critics alike, these movies became deified beyond belief and all criticism of them was shut down. But really, if the originals were subjected to the same level of scrutiny that the sequels were subjected to, and the prequels before them, they would fall apart immediately.


I have to say, I generally agree, insomuch as I don't find the sequel trilogy story to be anymore incoherent than the original trilogy story.

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by stevetotheizz0 »

Officer Evax was in A New Hope

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by arebelspy »

mingtown wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 12:01 pm
The Empire did nothing wrong.
Do you genuinely believe this?

What about blowing up Alderaan?

Like, I get, and agree with Jedi = bad guys.

But the Empire did nothing wrong? At all?

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by quesosauce37 »

arebelspy wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 7:13 pm
mingtown wrote:
July 13th, 2020, 12:01 pm
The Empire did nothing wrong.


What about blowing up Alderaan?

Alderaan was full of nothing but terrorists and hippies, good riddance!
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by The Franchise »

Jabba would have been more compelling if they kept him as the man in a fur coat instead of green slimer guy

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by Gergall »

hanotsri wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 5:57 pm
Return had to retcon Luke's sister into being Leia.
That is ridiculous, ESB very clearly teased Leia as Luke's sister.
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by JarJarDrinks »

stevetotheizz0 wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 6:11 pm
Officer Evax was in A New Hope
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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by hanotsri »

Gergall wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 10:34 pm
hanotsri wrote:
July 14th, 2020, 5:57 pm
Return had to retcon Luke's sister into being Leia.
That is ridiculous, ESB very clearly teased Leia as Luke's sister.
It teased someone else ala "there is another." No way she was intended to be his sister during ESB. They made out in the Hoth med center.

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Re: Most Controversial Star Wars Opinions

Post by chriskelly »

Also disagree with the point that there is nothing in ANH implying Vader is Luke’s father. There are lots of clues:
- Owen being afraid he had his father in him
- ben’s hesitation about telling luke how his father died
- Vader mentioning the force connection

None are really smoking guns but the clues are there looking back on it.
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Which yes I get there’s literature that said at the time George didn’t plan that, but when you watch the movies the films do not make it seem like his parentage is out of no where.

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