Light/dark win breakdown

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JarJarDrinks
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by JarJarDrinks »

The Smoking Gungan wrote:
JarJarDrinks wrote:
mryellow wrote:But it's nigh impossible to stop these two decks and also stop degenerate one-sided machine decks like Spice TIEs (Hayes was right), SYCFA, plus any number of excellent second-tier dark decks.
I think a great start is to kill spice TIEs once and for all. Not having to gameplan for a deck where there is no good way to interact will certainly only help.
Was that really true of chu's worlds build though? He ran one cannon and no talon rolls so it seems like you could have interacted with him easily enough
Not really. For starters, captal starships can't go there.

The deck can dedicate pretty much every slot it has to making sure it stays alive @ the 2 sectors. 5x APTW, 3x SRF combo, a cannon, the saber guys, etc... Only extremely dedicated space decks can really screw w/ them there. It's degenerate to have a deck that can win without putting guys to sites or systems.


dx_37 wrote:
October 2nd, 2019, 12:12 pm
I would be all for a reset if I get to be on the reset team
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by stevetotheizz0 »

Menace fades is a good card.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by eutychusrocks »

stevetotheizz0 wrote:It's the type pf deck that could use a few more meta counters as time goes one, but thats about it. Maybe a better way to cancel scum other than Audience chamber of You've got a lot of guts?
Those counters are fine, but there are decks that can't run the existing meta cards for slavers.
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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allstarz97 wrote:A Ls character that stops poa destinies would help(Jedi Luke v!!).
Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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jcb213 wrote: Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
FYI - She doesn't stop galen per a recent ruling by gergall.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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stevetotheizz0 wrote:
jcb213 wrote: Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
FYI - She doesn't stop galen per a recent ruling by gergall.
WHAT!?
dx_37 wrote:
October 2nd, 2019, 12:12 pm
I would be all for a reset if I get to be on the reset team
"Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking."
- Bill Maher

"How you play the game is important. But for me, it's about if you win or lose."
- Derek Jeter

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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JarJarDrinks wrote:
stevetotheizz0 wrote:
jcb213 wrote: Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
FYI - She doesn't stop galen per a recent ruling by gergall.
WHAT!?
/viewt ... =5&t=51615

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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JarJarDrinks wrote:
stevetotheizz0 wrote:
jcb213 wrote: Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
FYI - She doesn't stop galen per a recent ruling by gergall.
WHAT!?
The ruling must be wrong because she was designed to stop Galen, and I'm pretty sure I remember Aglets being involved in making sure the wording was correct so that it would work.

If opponent's [Virtual Block 6] card just added a destiny to total power or attrition here, draw two destiny, choose one, and subtract it from their attrition and total power.

How does that not work?

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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JediJer wrote:
JarJarDrinks wrote:
stevetotheizz0 wrote:
jcb213 wrote: Phylo Gandish (v)? (who is pullable by a used destiny 5 interrupt)
FYI - She doesn't stop galen per a recent ruling by gergall.
WHAT!?
The ruling must be wrong because she was designed to stop Galen, and I'm pretty sure I remember Aglets being involved in making sure the wording was correct so that it would work.

If opponent's [Virtual Block 6] card just added a destiny to total power or attrition here, draw two destiny, choose one, and subtract it from their attrition and total power.

How does that not work?
The saber specifically states that Galen adds the destiny, not the saber. Galen is a Block 4 card.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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The ruling is wrong, pls fix.

Unless we want to say that HDv doesn't cause force loss because the character is being hit by a lightsaber, not by vader or galen? Then I'm cool w/ it.
dx_37 wrote:
October 2nd, 2019, 12:12 pm
I would be all for a reset if I get to be on the reset team
"Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking."
- Bill Maher

"How you play the game is important. But for me, it's about if you win or lose."
- Derek Jeter

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by Hayes »

@ justin
It's only overpowered if you let it get to that point. If you can prevent the early flip by going down first (to space ideally) then they have to blow their wad to generate that much force. If they then spread (or are forced to because you played around a site they have solidified) you can just seeking or found someone your key guys back and hit them where they are weak/not at. Your game detail vs Reid is pretty typical imo, you just got a larger win than is normal because of his terrible start.

I conversation the fact you have to be playing a combative deck that is capable of going to the opponents locations to execute this kind of strategy, but honestly most viable light decks do fall into that category.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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how many people actually use phylo to beat Hdv?

Why more people don't use Dark Apprach v is weird though. It cancels Ponda Baba's destiny, Galen's and Saber Squadron tie destinies (for those worried about the "new" spice ties)
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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I used to use Dark Approach in all my decks, and then every good player I played against told me it was terrible and I needed to switch to HMBHT
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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Darth_Link wrote:how many people actually use phylo to beat Hdv?

Why more people don't use Dark Apprach v is weird though. It cancels Ponda Baba's destiny, Galen's and Saber Squadron tie destinies (for those worried about the "new" spice ties)
Has anyone ever tried Phylo in a non-alien deck to counter destinies to power and attrition, or is it one of those cards that people just look at and say "not worth it" without testing it?
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by allstarz97 »

Hayes wrote:@ justin
It's only overpowered if you let it get to that point. If you can prevent the early flip by going down first (to space ideally) then they have to blow their wad to generate that much force. If they then spread (or are forced to because you played around a site they have solidified) you can just seeking or found someone your key guys back and hit them where they are weak/not at. Your game detail vs Reid is pretty typical imo, you just got a larger win than is normal because of his terrible start.

I conversation the fact you have to be playing a combative deck that is capable of going to the opponents locations to execute this kind of strategy, but honestly most viable light decks do fall into that category.
About half the games play out that way, the other half involve DS flipping because you can't go to ground AND space (bear in mind I went first in my game vs reid...). So, a typical scenario is ds hits there pulls on their turn 1 and draws to 12. Ls plays a mace/qui/luke whomever to the ground. Ds activates a bunch, deploys like the space crusier + ors to kashyyyk, either plays a bunch of guys in front of your character and flips, or moves away, doesn't really matter, if they have a barrier they are in a pretty advantaged position at that point. You can choose to atk them in space, or go to their site, or like move to their 2-0 to flip them back, but all of those decision trainsaren't that advantageous given the resiliency of their cards.

It's also very possible you played against total idiots piloting slavers and won because of that, the first 3-4 games we had no clue how to make slavers work, after a while it became apparent they deck was almost invincible if things went it's way.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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...and I think that's basically the problem with the deck, and why some of the top players stayed away from it, when it is firing on all cylynders, it feels amazing, when it gets derailed, it feels awful. So the "Normal" ways a swccg deck can win are not apparent here. The deck can not dig itself out of a hole to save it's life, but it is also very hard to disrupt if it got a strong setup. It basically takes the first three turns of the game, and magnifies them. If they first three turns went your way you win, if they didn't you lose.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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allstarz97 wrote:...and I think that's basically the problem with the deck, and why some of the top players stayed away from it, when it is firing on all cylynders, it feels amazing, when it gets derailed, it feels awful. So the "Normal" ways a swccg deck can win are not apparent here. The deck can not dig itself out of a hole to save it's life, but it is also very hard to disrupt if it got a strong setup. It basically takes the first three turns of the game, and magnifies them. If they first three turns went your way you win, if they didn't you lose.
This unfortunately is what SW is now for the most part.
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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

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agnos wrote:
allstarz97 wrote:...and I think that's basically the problem with the deck, and why some of the top players stayed away from it, when it is firing on all cylynders, it feels amazing, when it gets derailed, it feels awful. So the "Normal" ways a swccg deck can win are not apparent here. The deck can not dig itself out of a hole to save it's life, but it is also very hard to disrupt if it got a strong setup. It basically takes the first three turns of the game, and magnifies them. If they first three turns went your way you win, if they didn't you lose.
This unfortunately is what SW is now for the most part.
Maybe in 2005. I'm pretty sure most people have been saying the exact opposite for a while now. That the game is slower than it's ever been.
dx_37 wrote:
October 2nd, 2019, 12:12 pm
I would be all for a reset if I get to be on the reset team
"Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking."
- Bill Maher

"How you play the game is important. But for me, it's about if you win or lose."
- Derek Jeter

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by allstarz97 »

JarJarDrinks wrote:
agnos wrote:
allstarz97 wrote:...and I think that's basically the problem with the deck, and why some of the top players stayed away from it, when it is firing on all cylynders, it feels amazing, when it gets derailed, it feels awful. So the "Normal" ways a swccg deck can win are not apparent here. The deck can not dig itself out of a hole to save it's life, but it is also very hard to disrupt if it got a strong setup. It basically takes the first three turns of the game, and magnifies them. If they first three turns went your way you win, if they didn't you lose.
This unfortunately is what SW is now for the most part.
Maybe in 2005. I'm pretty sure most people have been saying the exact opposite for a while now. That the game is slower than it's ever been.
Yeah I couldn't disagree more with agnos, almost all lightside decks ohter than wys v have to reactive and therefore dig themselves out of a lot of holes, and decks like hd v or kessel mains are very reactive as well. And walkers, despite it's generically strong start, actually has to win the game because while the turn it blows the mpg is an awesome one, the next few turns can actually be very unimpressive.

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Re: Light/dark win breakdown

Post by Blarg »

One thing I've noticed is that while DS has many different kinds of decks (Mains, Scum, Walkers, Clouds, ROPS) that all have to be dealt with in very different ways, LS pretty much just has WYSv and Mains. So most DS decks only really need two different gameplans, while LS decks need to be able to deal with a lot more things. Note that even if you don't classify Communing as a mains deck, most gameplans against Communing are very similar to those against mains decks.

More options for LS would mean that DS has to be more flexible, and that would lower the power level of DS decks.

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